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#1
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STAR to nearby airport
Recently while returning from a trip I was heading to my home base, which is
a class D airport. I was handed off to the local tracon, which has a class C airport, and was issued a clearance to follow a star that led to a navaid near my destination. However, the star was for the class C airport, not my destination. The class D airport is well outside of the class C airspace but inside the area covered by the tracon. I happened to know the star was for the class C airport, and followed it appropriately. However, in the Jepps it is listed under the class C, and not my destination. I have never encountered this before even in a busy radar environment- is this a common controller technique for arrivals? If I had been unfamiliar with the area and approaches, this could have caused a few moments of frantic chart flipping. Besides, the star did not list my destination airport as one of the transitions, although a nearby navaid is the IAP for several approaches. Since my last clearance was the star into the class c airport, if I had gone nordo, would I have been expected to fly to the class C airport listed in the star and do an approach , or should I do an approach to my destination, even if not listed in the star? |
#2
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"Viperdoc" wrote: [snip] I have never encountered this before even in a busy radar environment- is this a common controller technique for arrivals? Well, it's common at least in the Houston terminal area. Besides, the star did not list my destination airport as one of the transitions, although a nearby navaid is the IAP for several approaches. When I used to land at EYQ in Houston, I'd get the Trinity 1 arrival every time, even though EYQ is not depicted on the STAR plate. Since my last clearance was the star into the class c airport, if I had gone nordo, would I have been expected to fly to the class C airport listed in the star and do an approach , or should I do an approach to my destination, even if not listed in the star? If you were cleared to the destination airport via the STAR, you should fly the STAR, shoot an approach (if in IMC) and land. Don't do this if you're a hundred miles out, though. The consensus of controllers and instructors I have talked to is that a NORDO IFR aircraft is a major pain in the airspace: ATC wants you to land as expeditiously as possible. -- Dan C172RG at BFM |
#3
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"Viperdoc" wrote in message ... Recently while returning from a trip I was heading to my home base, which is a class D airport. I was handed off to the local tracon, which has a class C airport, and was issued a clearance to follow a star that led to a navaid near my destination. However, the star was for the class C airport, not my destination. The class D airport is well outside of the class C airspace but inside the area covered by the tracon. What's your home base? |
#4
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Viperdoc wrote:
Recently while returning from a trip I was heading to my home base, which is a class D airport. I was handed off to the local tracon, which has a class C airport, and was issued a clearance to follow a star that led to a navaid near my destination. However, the star was for the class C airport, not my destination. The class D airport is well outside of the class C airspace but inside the area covered by the tracon. I happened to know the star was for the class C airport, and followed it appropriately. However, in the Jepps it is listed under the class C, and not my destination. I have never encountered this before even in a busy radar environment- is this a common controller technique for arrivals? When I used to frequently fly to GAI in the Washington area, I would often get the COATTx arrival for Dulles, then vectors to GAI, so I'd say it's fairly common. Apparently there is some kind of list of "eligible airports" for a STAR. These NOTAMs have been showing up lately for TTA, which is near Raleigh-Durham's class C. ARGAL5 and BRADE5 are arrivals for RDU. DUAT plain-language translation: Sanford NC (Sanford-Lee County Rgnl) [TTA]: January NOTAM #13 issued by UAR ARGAL five arrival (ARGAL. ARGAL5) add TTA as an ELIGIBLE airport effective from January 30th, 2004 at 11:24 AM EDT (0401301524) Sanford NC (Sanford-Lee County Rgnl) [TTA]: January NOTAM #12 issued by UAR BRADE five arrival (BRADE. BRADE5) add TTA as an ELIGIBLE airport effective from January 30th, 2004 at 11:20 AM EDT (0401301520) If I had been unfamiliar with the area and approaches, this could have caused a few moments of frantic chart flipping. Besides, the star did not list my destination airport as one of the transitions, although a nearby navaid is the IAP for several approaches. Since my last clearance was the star into the class c airport, if I had gone nordo, would I have been expected to fly to the class C airport listed in the star and do an approach , or should I do an approach to my destination, even if not listed in the star? What was your clearance limit? Dave Remove SHIRT to reply directly. |
#5
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Dave Butler writes:
Apparently there is some kind of list of "eligible airports" for a STAR. These NOTAMs have been showing up lately for TTA, which is near Raleigh-Durham's class C. ARGAL5 and BRADE5 are arrivals for RDU. DUAT plain-language translation: Sanford NC (Sanford-Lee County Rgnl) [TTA]: January NOTAM #13 issued by UAR ARGAL five arrival (ARGAL. ARGAL5) add TTA as an ELIGIBLE airport effective from January 30th, 2004 at 11:24 AM EDT (0401301524) Sanford NC (Sanford-Lee County Rgnl) [TTA]: January NOTAM #12 issued by UAR BRADE five arrival (BRADE. BRADE5) add TTA as an ELIGIBLE airport effective from January 30th, 2004 at 11:20 AM EDT (0401301520) Idle curiosity: I wonder why the oddball effective times. If you were approaching at 15:22, you could be issued BRADE5 but not ARGAL5. Two minutes earlier and you can get neither and two minutes later you can get either. |
#6
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Take a look at KCVG (Greater Cincinnati International). This is CBAS and all the airports with instrument approaches within the Mode C veil use the SIDs and STARs. I always file "NO SIDS OR STARS" in the Remarks. |
#7
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"EDR" wrote in message ... Take a look at KCVG (Greater Cincinnati International). This is CBAS and all the airports with instrument approaches within the Mode C veil use the SIDs and STARs. I always file "NO SIDS OR STARS" in the Remarks. Why do you do that? |
#8
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EDR wrote:
Take a look at KCVG (Greater Cincinnati International). I don't understand. What do you mean "take a look at..."? Is there some document you want me to see? This is CBAS and all the airports with instrument approaches within the Mode C veil use the SIDs and STARs. Where does it say that? In the document you want me to take a look at? I always file "NO SIDS OR STARS" in the Remarks. Why do you do that? Not intentionally dense, I'm just not getting your meaning, somehow. Dave Remove SHIRT to reply directly. |
#9
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In article , Dave Butler
wrote: EDR wrote: Take a look at KCVG (Greater Cincinnati International). I don't understand. What do you mean "take a look at..."? Is there some document you want me to see? This is CBAS and all the airports with instrument approaches within the Mode C veil use the SIDs and STARs. Where does it say that? In the document you want me to take a look at? NOTAMs and Approach Plates I always file "NO SIDS OR STARS" in the Remarks. Why do you do that? Not intentionally dense, I'm just not getting your meaning, somehow. I am not a jet jockey. I fly a slow spam can. If I am given a SID or STAR I am going to be flying miles out of my way, well below traffic that the procedures are designed to separate. |
#10
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I always file "NO SIDS OR STARS" in the Remarks.
Don't they just give you the SID or STAR anyway, just spell it out for you? They want to vector you far away, they vector you far away./ Jose -- (for Email, make the obvious changes in my address) |
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