Question: "Overhead Entry to Downwind?"

Bill Zaleski wrote:

I read an NTSB decision that violated a 135 operator for turning a 5
mile final from a right base. If that is considered "approaching to
land", then surely the 45 entry must be also.

I read it too. It was his base to final turn. We're
talking about a 45 entry turn that is 2 turns before the
base to final turn. You tell me - is distance or number of
turns more important? How about time? There must be some
transition between "not yet approaching to land" and
"approaching to land," but I don't think we can say that
it's always illegal to make right hand turns within 5 miles
of the airport you want to land at.
Todd Pattist
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"Todd Pattist" wrote in message
...

I read it too. It was his base to final turn. We're
talking about a 45 entry turn that is 2 turns before the
base to final turn. You tell me - is distance or number of
turns more important? How about time? There must be some
transition between "not yet approaching to land" and
"approaching to land," but I don't think we can say that
it's always illegal to make right hand turns within 5 miles
of the airport you want to land at.


The regulation says when approaching to land at an airport without an
operating control tower each pilot of an airplane must make all turns of
that airplane to the left. Logically, any turn made for the purpose of
aligning the airplane with the landing runway is such a turn and must be
made to the left. That would include all turns in the pattern and the
pattern entry.

"Steven P. McNicoll"
wrote:

The regulation says when approaching to land at an airport without an
operating control tower each pilot of an airplane must make all turns of
that airplane to the left.

Agreed. I submit, that it is legal to make right hand turns
in airplanes at some point during flight after departure and
prior to landing. I also submit that during that period of
time when it is legal to make such right turns that one is
*not* "approaching to land." Consequently, I submit that
there is a dividing line between the "not approaching to
land" when it is legal to turn right and "approaching to
land" when the FAR's prohibit it. That dividing line will
come into play if any of us are ever accused of violating
91.126.

Logically, any turn made for the purpose of
aligning the airplane with the landing runway is such a turn and must be
made to the left. That would include all turns in the pattern and the
pattern entry.

If you are right, then the 45 entry is in violation of
91.126. However, I have my doubts that the application of
"logic" is particularly useful in interpreting the FAR's.:-)
It's probably better to look at the Chief Counsel's
interpretations and the NTSB hearing records

To my knowledge, no pilot has ever been violated for a 45
entry, and many cases have upheld the AIM's recommendations
as good operating practices, so 45 entries are pretty safe
to use, and the disparity between the AIM and 91.126 is
little more than a curiosity that the FAA likes to ignore.
Todd Pattist
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"Todd Pattist" wrote in message
...

If you are right, then the 45 entry is in violation of
91.126. However, I have my doubts that the application of
"logic" is particularly useful in interpreting the FAR's.:-)
It's probably better to look at the Chief Counsel's
interpretations and the NTSB hearing records

To my knowledge, no pilot has ever been violated for a 45
entry, and many cases have upheld the AIM's recommendations
as good operating practices, so 45 entries are pretty safe
to use, and the disparity between the AIM and 91.126 is
little more than a curiosity that the FAA likes to ignore.


Agreed.

To my knowledge, no pilot has ever been violated for a 45
entry,

Nor any flight instructor for telling his students to do it that way,
which includes all the flight instructors who were brave enough to
take me up.

all the best -- Dan Ford
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