AOPA Propaganda, cont.

That is true, they provide low enroute around Vance in
Oklahoma and Wichita Falls in Texas.

There are "letters of agreement" that setup who does what
for and when.

But the fact is that ATC services are generally un-needed by
GA and often used only because they are required by law.
The controllers would be sitting there, doing very little if
all they had was airline and military traffic, except in the
busiest areas, most GA flight don't need the FAA very much.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

"George Patterson" wrote in message
news:3mMnf.13741$Ea6.3926@trnddc08...
| Jim Macklin wrote:
|
| The military uses
| their own controllers in their airspace and FAA services
in
| civil airspace.
|
| The military also provides ATC services in certain areas.
Most traffic in
| central New Jersey is handled by McGuire AFB.
|
| George Patterson
| Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by
rights belong to
| your slightly older self.

Nice thing about military controllers, they are polite,
skilled and actually say things like "Sir" to all pilots.


"Jay Beckman" wrote in message
news:fvMnf.85$vx.51@fed1read01...
| "George Patterson" wrote in message
| news:3mMnf.13741$Ea6.3926@trnddc08...
| Jim Macklin wrote:
|
| The military uses their own controllers in their
airspace and FAA
| services in civil airspace.
|
| The military also provides ATC services in certain
areas. Most traffic in
| central New Jersey is handled by McGuire AFB.
|
| George Patterson
|
| As a matter of fact, I spent a little time being
shephearded by controllers
| at Luke AFB just this afternoon.
|
| Jay Beckman
| PP-ASEL
| AZ Cloudbusters
| Chandler, AZ
|
|

"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
news:yBNnf.60136$sg5.7675@dukeread12...
Nice thing about military controllers, they are polite,
skilled and actually say things like "Sir" to all pilots.

The thing that I find interesting (and I admit that I'm basing this on only
100-ish hours of experience) is that the controllers at Luke AFB all sound
really, well, glad to have you in their airspace.

It's also cool to hear them working the military flights too (it sounds as
though they multiplex some UHF radio traffic with their VHF ... better SA
for all involved maybe?)

Jay B

Military controller are not unionized government employees,
they know they are down there, because we are up there, the
civilian controllers (too often, not all) think we are up
there because they are down there.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

"Jay Beckman" wrote in message
news:bDOnf.95$vx.59@fed1read01...
| "Jim Macklin" wrote
in message
| news:yBNnf.60136$sg5.7675@dukeread12...
| Nice thing about military controllers, they are polite,
| skilled and actually say things like "Sir" to all
pilots.
|
| The thing that I find interesting (and I admit that I'm
basing this on only
| 100-ish hours of experience) is that the controllers at
Luke AFB all sound
| really, well, glad to have you in their airspace.
|
| It's also cool to hear them working the military flights
too (it sounds as
| though they multiplex some UHF radio traffic with their
VHF ... better SA
| for all involved maybe?)
|
| Jay B
|
|

The thing that I find interesting (and I admit that I'm basing this on only
100-ish hours of experience) is that the controllers at Luke AFB all sound
really, well, glad to have you in their airspace.

If you ever fly to Pueblo CO (KPUB) the controllers there (civilian ?)
are also nice and happy to have you there.

Ron Lee

Orville, referring to local noise ordinances and motorcyles,
leaf-blowers, etc, said:
"If you use any of the above more than 1000 ft away from anyone, there is

no way to enforce it."

What the...? The heat, the Florida sun, and the noise and rattling of the
small plane must be to blame.

"Ron Lee" wrote in message
...

The thing that I find interesting (and I admit that I'm basing this on
only
100-ish hours of experience) is that the controllers at Luke AFB all sound
really, well, glad to have you in their airspace.

If you ever fly to Pueblo CO (KPUB) the controllers there (civilian ?)
are also nice and happy to have you there.

Ron Lee

Ron,

I didn't mean it to sound like I've never heard friendly civilian
controllers...they definately exisist too. My local Class D has them in
spades. I still get a little automatic smile whenever I hear one gentleman
in particular as he was on duty the day I solo'd and the day I came wobbling
back from my long solo XC. He gave me a "congrats" on both occasions.

I just thought the point of the earlier discussions was that it was unusual
for GA to be handled by military controllers. My point was that it happens
here when you are SW of Phoenix and they're really efficient, to the point
but polite, agreeable and (so far) never seem fazed by having Cessna's in
the mix.

Jay B

In article
outaviation.com,
"Skylune" wrote:

Orville, referring to local noise ordinances and motorcyles,
leaf-blowers, etc, said:
"If you use any of the above more than 1000 ft away from anyone, there is

no way to enforce it."

What the...? The heat, the Florida sun, and the noise and rattling of the
small plane must be to blame.

It is COLD here -- mid-60s! :)

At least I have a plane and am able to fly it competently -- unlike an
obnoxious loon whom we all know and love!

--
Remve "_" from email to reply to me personally.

West of the Mississippi River and not California metro
areas, controllers are very nice, helpful, polite and even
in the rude parts of the country (Chicago, New York, St.
Louis, etc) where being rude seems to be a local disease,
many controllers are unspoiled.

But when you ask for a deviation for weather and the
controller comes back with "Are you declaring an emergency?"
or some other challenge, rather than a useful reply, it
means that all controllers get a black eye.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm



"Ron Lee" wrote in message
...
|
| The thing that I find interesting (and I admit that I'm
basing this on only
| 100-ish hours of experience) is that the controllers at
Luke AFB all sound
| really, well, glad to have you in their airspace.
|
| If you ever fly to Pueblo CO (KPUB) the controllers there
(civilian ?)
| are also nice and happy to have you there.
|
| Ron Lee
|

Jay Beckman wrote:

I just thought the point of the earlier discussions was that it was unusual
for GA to be handled by military controllers. My point was that it happens
here when you are SW of Phoenix and they're really efficient, to the point
but polite, agreeable and (so far) never seem fazed by having Cessna's in
the mix.

Yep, we have a military base (Fort Drum) located in north-central NY that
controls all airspace north of Syracuse and west of the Adirondack
mountains below 10,000 feet or so. They'll even let you fly a PAR into
their runway, as long as you don't touch wheels to runway.

--
Peter