NATCA Going Down in Flames

On 4 Sep 2006 15:17:06 -0700, "Jay Honeck" wrote
in .com:

Of course, Mr. Honeck might not have a problem with the practices at
EDS.

Okay, I give. What the heck is "EDS"?

EDS is Electronic Data Systems, Inc., the folks that do IT for GM.
They have a reputation in the industry for draconian labor practices
(as did Henry Ford):

http://www.realchange.org/perot.htm
Abusing His Employees
Perot is by all accounts a great motivator, a man who demands
great loyalty and extreme hard work from employees, but also can
repay it with striking acts of generosity (though rarely much in
the way of wages.) He has done things like fly a new employee's
wife to Johns Hopkins Hospital in his Lear Jet, after she injured
her eye.

At the same time, the relationship he creates is one where Perot
is all-powerful, and bestows his generosities from on high. He
works people extremely hard for little money, and subjects them to
intrusive scrutiny, including private investigators, wiretaps,
drug tests and lie detector tests.

In this regard, he bears a striking resemblance to Ralph Nader, of
all people, who also inspires great loyalty, pushes himself at
least as hard as he pushes his employees, burns people out for
little money, and seems to feel he has a right to monitor and
control their lives.

For example, discussing salaries has been an immediate firing
offense from the first days at EDS, Perot's company. The company
dress code, up into the 1970s, required white shirts only for men
(he considered blue shirts effeminate), no pants or flats for
women, and no "mod looks," as the contract put it. But the
intrusion went much further.

EDS tapped phones and used detectives to investigate its own
employees, according to Posner. He traced license plate numbers in
the parking lot to see who came late or left early, just as Nader
telephones employees at home on sunny weekends to test how long
they work. And in "particularly heated" fights for contracts,
employees on the bid team would be physically searched to ensure
they did not remove any paperwork that could assist the
opposition. (Posner, p94-5)


http://www.vault.com/survey/employee...YEER-3100.html

"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
...
EDS is Electronic Data Systems, Inc., the folks that do IT for GM.
They have a reputation in the industry for draconian labor practices
(as did Henry Ford):


Ross Perot is also the man who moved heaven and hell to get his people out
of Iran when the Shah was ousted...

As for Henry Ford, he may not have been as draconian as a lot of people
think. My maternal grandfather went to work for ol' Henry after graduating
from Ford's first industrial education program. I've been told by family
that any time Henry came down to the production floor, he would seek out my
grandfather, greeted him by name and would always inquire about his health
and happiness. It has also been said that Mr. Ford (in the early days)
maintained a fairly "open door policy" for his empoyees.

Perhaps once Ford Motor Company began it's exponential growth this practice
simply became untenable.

Jay B

Jay Honeck has started one of the most interesting threads in a long
time. 0-160 comments in less then a day,, WOW. Reading all sides of the
issues is pretty damn entertaining and ya got to admit, We do live in a
great country and that first amendment thing is a wonderful thing too..
G

One can clearly see who is a union member, and who is not, thats for
sure..

Ok Jay, for your next assignment if you wish to accept is to start a
thread on politics or religion. This suggestion will self destruct in
20 seconds......

Ben.



Jay Beckman wrote:
"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
...
EDS is Electronic Data Systems, Inc., the folks that do IT for GM.
They have a reputation in the industry for draconian labor practices
(as did Henry Ford):


Ross Perot is also the man who moved heaven and hell to get his people out
of Iran when the Shah was ousted...

As for Henry Ford, he may not have been as draconian as a lot of people
think. My maternal grandfather went to work for ol' Henry after graduating
from Ford's first industrial education program. I've been told by family
that any time Henry came down to the production floor, he would seek out my
grandfather, greeted him by name and would always inquire about his health
and happiness. It has also been said that Mr. Ford (in the early days)
maintained a fairly "open door policy" for his empoyees.

Perhaps once Ford Motor Company began it's exponential growth this practice
simply became untenable.

Jay B

wrote

Jay Honeck has started one of the most interesting threads in a long
time. 0-160 comments in less then a day,,

Interesting? Not to me.

Remember, also, that quantify is not equal to quality.
--
Jim in NC

Interesting? Not to me.

Really? I find it fascinating.

Unfortunately, it's the same fascination that won't let you avert your
eyes when you're witnessing a train wreck. Controllers, by their
actions, have harmed GA's chances of avoiding privatization in ways
that no other single action could have accoplished. And we're all
going to pay for it.

All because they don't want to be "forced" to wear dockers and a nice
shirt to work.

:-(
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay Honeck wrote:

Really? I find it fascinating.

Unfortunately, it's the same fascination that won't let you avert your
eyes when you're witnessing a train wreck. Controllers, by their
actions, have harmed GA's chances of avoiding privatization in ways
that no other single action could have accoplished. And we're all
going to pay for it.

All because they don't want to be "forced" to wear dockers and a nice
shirt to work.


Why should government employees that aren't even seen by the customer
be forced to wear dockers and a nice shirt to work while private sector
employees that must interact with customers, like those at the Alexis
Park Inn, can dress like bums?

Your position appears to be solely based on your noted dislike of
government employees.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:

Why should government employees that aren't even seen by the customer
be forced to wear dockers and a nice shirt to work while private sector
employees that must interact with customers, like those at the Alexis
Park Inn, can dress like bums?

Your position appears to be solely based on your noted dislike of
government employees.

Steven, I am not sure that his position is based upon dislike. But if
it is, maybe it is just unionized "babies."

Ron Lee

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in
oups.com:


Jay Honeck wrote:

Really? I find it fascinating.

Unfortunately, it's the same fascination that won't let you avert your
eyes when you're witnessing a train wreck. Controllers, by their
actions, have harmed GA's chances of avoiding privatization in ways
that no other single action could have accoplished. And we're all
going to pay for it.

All because they don't want to be "forced" to wear dockers and a nice
shirt to work.


Why should government employees that aren't even seen by the customer
be forced to wear dockers and a nice shirt to work while private sector
employees that must interact with customers, like those at the Alexis
Park Inn, can dress like bums?

Simply because Alexis Park Inn is a private enterprise which is subject to
its customers' preferences for its survival. If the customers dislike the
dress code at the Inn enough, they will take their business elsewhere.

Your position appears to be solely based on your noted dislike of
government employees.

Government employees are not subject to market forces the way private
sector employees are. Customer dissatisfaction with their product does not
cause them lose jobs or pay. Therefore, they do not necessarily feel the
same pressure to produce goods and services that satisfy their customers.

An external device, such as a reasonable dress code, might go a long way
towards instituting some of that discipline.

The only reason controllers can feel like they can oppose management on
every issue is because they think the government monopoly that has
provided them with their jobs and pay is forever going to be there.

They are wrong.

Sinan

--
A. Sinan Unur
(remove .invalid and reverse each component for email address)

In article .com,
" wrote:

One can clearly see who is a union member, and who is not, thats for
sure..

really?

Am I union or not?

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate

wrote:

Jay Honeck has started one of the most interesting threads in a long
time. 0-160 comments in less then a day,, WOW. Reading all sides of the
issues is pretty damn entertaining and ya got to admit, We do live in a
great country and that first amendment thing is a wonderful thing too..
G

One can clearly see who is a union member, and who is not, thats for
sure..


Ya think? Am I a union member or not?