Low fuel emergency in DFW

I think I have a pretty good understanding.

I do know that no controller from any facility with traffic
like DFW has responded. So, if there is a DFW or ATL or
ORD, LAX or SFO controller out there, how long would it take
to clear the required airspace v. just fitting the emergency
into the traffic.






"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in
message
nk.net...
|
| "Jim Macklin" wrote
in message
| news |
| I don't think you understand the complexity of the
airspace
| around DFW, with arrival gates, departure corridors,
| multiple runways.
|
| It is not a 1 minute or a two minute exercise to "clear
the
| airspace" neither does a 10° heading change create legal
| separation in one minute.
|
|
| You don't understand how ATC works.
|
|

"Jim Macklin" writes:

I don't think you understand the complexity of the airspace
around DFW, with arrival gates, departure corridors,
multiple runways.

No matter what the complexity, it only takes a few minutes to clear a path.

It is not a 1 minute or a two minute exercise to "clear the
airspace" neither does a 10° heading change create legal
separation in one minute.

Show me the transcripts and radar traces, so that I can see how long it
actually takes.

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"Jim Macklin" writes:

That is not an option for all the other airplanes or ATC.

Yes, it is, when an emergency exists.

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B A R R Y writes:

But then again, they're also pilots, as I believe you are.

Even the ones who aren't pilots would agree. I'm quite surprised that anyone
in ATC would make a mistake as stupid as this one. One wonders where they
found that supervisor.

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"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Danny Deger" wrote in message
...

A compressor stall in a two engine airplane was not seviour enough to
blow
off IFR separation from other aircraft if I had been IMC. At least that
was the decision I made at the time. If I had been on fire, I would have
turned then told the controller I had turned.


What did you say to the controller when you declared the emergency?


I think is was something like "I am declaring an emergency for an engine
failure". I definately used the "e" word. I was well trained as an Air
Force pilot to use the "e" word.



I used to own a Bonanza and if was VMC I would often "Cancel IFR" if I
was
being vector all over the place or if VFR and being vectored all over the
place I would "Cancel Radar Service". Those are two very powerful
statements that you don't need an emergency to use.


Generally, if you're operating VFR in an area where ATC can initiate
vectoring, you're not in an area where you can "cancel radar service".

You are correct. I fly out or a small airport South East of Houston. I can
go due west and barely miss where Class B goes to the surface south of
Houston Hobby. Often I would contact approach control and immediately be
given a vector to the south. After a couple of times following the
recommended vectors I realized the standard was to send me about 20 miles
south before turning me back to the west. I got in the habit of cancelling
radar surface as soon as I got the vector to the south. I would then stay
below the class B space and head west.

Danny Deger

B A R R Y writes:

Fortunately, I've always been able to reply to the negative, but
declaring does have some significance.

It lets ATC off the hook and allows them to do whatever is required to help
you. It lets them bend all the rules and it lets them say "yes" to any
request you make. I think it benefits ATC more than it does the pilot,
although it can certainly help to have ATC moving other people out of your way
and rolling equipment, if need be.

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Danny Deger writes:

I think the point is at a busy airport the taxiways are often crowded with
aircraft waiting for takeoff.

There's always a space somewhere for an aircraft to turn to clear the runway.
You don't have aircraft waiting at every intersection.

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"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
...

I think I have a pretty good understanding.


Yes, but you don't actually have a good understanding.

"Jim Macklin" writes:

Which law, rule or regulation allows near mid-air collisions
because one aircraft has a cob up their ass?

None. But the law allows anything for an aircraft in an emergency.
Near-midair collisions are not a risk, anyway.

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Which law, rule or regulation allows near mid-air collisions
because one aircraft has a cob up their ass?

The one that gives an emergency aircraft priority over all other aircraft.

Jose
--
Humans are pack animals. Above all things, they have a deep need to
follow something, be it a leader, a creed, or a mob. Whosoever fully
understands this holds the world in his hands.
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