Chinese (and other) pilots unable to speak English pose danger for air travel (CNN)

Mxsmanic wrote:

David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*) writes:

The next language _you_ try maybe. It's rarely of any use to me when I
travel (outside French speaking countries)- even in Europe. Despite
being an American, you have adopted a very French perspective, but it's
******** if you travel to most countries outside France.

There's nothing specifically French about the perspective, although I'm sure
it pleases the French.

It's a skewed perspective with no basis in the reality of the world
today.

I've still had cases in which I've been asked to speak
to executives from non-French-speaking countries in French rather than English
because they knew French far better (having studied it in school).

There are cases where non-German native executives would rather you
speak to them in German than English too. So what? It's the numbers that
matter.

There are many people who study only French (particularly if their first
language is already English),

See below!

or both English and French. French has long
been extremely popular as a foreign language.

Extremely popular is meaningless. In the US, for example, which is the
most populous English speaking country in the world, high school
students are now learning Spanish at a rate almost 4 times that of
French. In the UK too, learning French as a second language is seen as
less important than it used to be.

--
(*) ... of the royal duchy of city south and deansgate
http://www.davidhorne.net - real address on website
"Abominable, loyal, blind, apparently subservient."
Pres. Carter on Pres. Blair- May, 2007

David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*) writes:

It's a skewed perspective with no basis in the reality of the world
today.

You're entitled to your opinion.

There are cases where non-German native executives would rather you
speak to them in German than English too.

For these executives, French was not their native language.

Extremely popular is meaningless. In the US, for example, which is the
most populous English speaking country in the world, high school
students are now learning Spanish at a rate almost 4 times that of
French.

Spanish has more practical value than French in the U.S., and it's easier to
learn, at least at lower levels and in terms of pronunciation.

In the UK too, learning French as a second language is seen as
less important than it used to be.

But they are still learning mostly French, aren't they?

Mxsmanic wrote:

David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*) writes:

It's a skewed perspective with no basis in the reality of the world
today.

You're entitled to your opinion.

There are cases where non-German native executives would rather you
speak to them in German than English too.

For these executives, French was not their native language.

Same with the non-German native executives.


Extremely popular is meaningless. In the US, for example, which is the
most populous English speaking country in the world, high school
students are now learning Spanish at a rate almost 4 times that of
French.

Spanish has more practical value than French in the U.S., and it's easier to
learn, at least at lower levels and in terms of pronunciation.

In the UK too, learning French as a second language is seen as
less important than it used to be.

But they are still learning mostly French, aren't they?

Less than before, which reflects a European wide trend, where French at
higher level is 28% compared to German at 20%. That's the point. In any
case, you suggested that native english speakers learned French- the US
alone blows that 'statistic' out of the water. In Australia too,
Japanese has surpassed French as the most widely studied language.


--
(*) ... of the royal duchy of city south and deansgate
http://www.davidhorne.net - real address on website
"Abominable, loyal, blind, apparently subservient."
Pres. Carter on Pres. Blair- May, 2007

Mxsmanic wrote in
:

David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*) writes:

It's a skewed perspective with no basis in the reality of the world
today.

You're entitled to your opinion.

There are cases where non-German native executives would rather you
speak to them in German than English too.

For these executives, French was not their native language.


Whoosh
Bertie

"David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*)" wrote in message
...
Mxsmanic wrote:

David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*) writes:

Extremely popular is meaningless. In the US, for example, which is the
most populous English speaking country in the world, high school
students are now learning Spanish at a rate almost 4 times that of
French. In the UK too, learning French as a second language is seen as
less important than it used to be.

Actually the most populous English speaking country is India.

S Green writes:

Actually the most populous English speaking country is India.

India is not an English-speaking country; it is simply a country in which many
people are reasonably fluent in English, which is not the same thing. The
population is primarily rural and most people do not speak fluent English, or
any English for that matter. However, English is the most popular second
language AFAIK and is widely spoken to some extent among those with an
education. It is a useful language for communication between different
segments of Indian society, since there are 15 different languages that are
widely used in the country (Hindi is about one third of the total). Native
English speakers are rare.

The greatest population of native English speakers is in the United States.
Canadians speak essentially the same English and add to this total.

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
S Green writes:

Actually the most populous English speaking country is India.

India is not an English-speaking country; it is simply a country in which
many
people are reasonably fluent in English, which is not the same thing. The
population is primarily rural and most people do not speak fluent English,
or
any English for that matter. However, English is the most popular second
language AFAIK and is widely spoken to some extent among those with an
education.

Nope.

It is undoubtedly the most popular language.

Native
English speakers are rare.


Most of the Christian population speak English as a first language.

That's 60 million...


--
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

Craig Welch wrote:
David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*) wrote:

Extremely popular is meaningless. In the US, for example, which is
the most populous English speaking country in the world, high school
students are now learning Spanish at a rate almost 4 times that of
French.

The US is not the most populous English speaking country in the world.

I think at this point a reasonable rebuttal would go on to say something
like "The country with that honor is X, and my source for that
information is Y."

So here's what I consider a reasonable rebuttal to your rebuttal:

http://www.mapsofworld.com/world-top...eaker-map.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language

You'll note that both web sites list the US as the country with the most
native speakers of English. At this point the typical Usenet rebuttal to
my post would be to say something like "Yes, but I meant to include
people for whom English is a second language, and my source is the same
Wikipedia page you reference. You'll note that it lists India as the
country with the most speakers of English, with China the second largest."

(I thought I'd save time by doing both halves of the dialogue. :-))

Jim Logajan wrote:

Craig Welch wrote:

David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*) wrote:


Extremely popular is meaningless. In the US, for example, which is
the most populous English speaking country in the world, high school
students are now learning Spanish at a rate almost 4 times that of
French.

The US is not the most populous English speaking country in the world.


I think at this point a reasonable rebuttal would go on to say something
like "The country with that honor is X, and my source for that
information is Y."

So here's what I consider a reasonable rebuttal to your rebuttal:

http://www.mapsofworld.com/world-top...eaker-map.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language


Wikipedia is NOT an authoritative source.

NotABushSupporter wrote:
Jim Logajan wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language


Wikipedia is NOT an authoritative source.

Indeed. But in the Wikipedia article it provides references to its sources
(which some articles notably lack). I normally prefer using authoritative
and as unbiased sources as possible for topics I'm more serious about. I'm
just not that serious about this topic. :-)