IFR in uncontroller airspace

"Ron Natalie" wrote in message m...
: Under IFR rules. You can't fly in conditions below the VFR weather
: minimums (legally) except IFR.
:
: This means you must be:
:
: 1. Instrument rated.
: 2. Have a plane with the necessary equipment and
: inspections for IFR flight.
: 3. Maintain the minimum altitudes
: 4. Pilot must be IFR current.
: 5. If you can arrive VFR at the destination, you must have an
: instrument approach.
:
: Except for takeoffs and landings from airports that don't have
: surface areas, practical IFR in uncontrolled airspace is thwarted
: by #3 and #5 above in most cases. You can't do enroute below
: 1000'/2000' (normal/mountainous) and most approaches will start
: in controlled airspace even if they don't terminate there.
:
: There's also a (not supported by regulation) legal interpretation
: where a guy was strung up where the FAA interpretted it as
: reckless and dangerous because he did not have an IFR clearance
: at the time he took off to continue his flight into controlled
: airspace.


Well I'll be, I never understood that. So basically you are saying 1000' AGL instrument flight in non-mountainous areas
is legal as long as you stay in class G, also assuming you and the plane are current, and that the landing airport
exceeds VFR minimums when you get there. I never thought anyone would operate in class G at less than VFR minimums...

"Blueskies" wrote in message
t...

Well I'll be, I never understood that. So basically you are saying 1000'
AGL
instrument flight in non-mountainous areas is legal as long as you stay in
class
G, also assuming you and the plane are current, and that the landing
airport
exceeds VFR minimums when you get there.


You've also got to cruise at a cardinal altitude appropriate for your
direction of flight.

On Apr 15, 5:25 pm, "Blueskies" wrote:
"Ron Natalie" wrote in ting.com...

: Under IFR rules. You can't fly in conditions below the VFR weather
: minimums (legally) except IFR.
:
: This means you must be:
:
: 1. Instrument rated.
: 2. Have a plane with the necessary equipment and
: inspections for IFR flight.
: 3. Maintain the minimum altitudes
: 4. Pilot must be IFR current.
: 5. If you can arrive VFR at the destination, you must have an
: instrument approach.
:
: Except for takeoffs and landings from airports that don't have
: surface areas, practical IFR in uncontrolled airspace is thwarted
: by #3 and #5 above in most cases. You can't do enroute below
: 1000'/2000' (normal/mountainous) and most approaches will start
: in controlled airspace even if they don't terminate there.
:
: There's also a (not supported by regulation) legal interpretation
: where a guy was strung up where the FAA interpretted it as
: reckless and dangerous because he did not have an IFR clearance
: at the time he took off to continue his flight into controlled
: airspace.

Well I'll be, I never understood that. So basically you are saying 1000' AGL instrument flight in non-mountainous areas
is legal as long as you stay in class G, also assuming you and the plane are current, and that the landing airport
exceeds VFR minimums when you get there. I never thought anyone would operate in class G at less than VFR minimums...

So you've never taken off IFR from an airport that didn't have class D
(or E) to the surface???

-Robert

Robert M. Gary wrote:


So you've never taken off IFR from an airport that didn't have class D
(or E) to the surface???


Or landed.

"Ron Natalie" wrote in message m...
: Robert M. Gary wrote:
:
:
: So you've never taken off IFR from an airport that didn't have class D
: (or E) to the surface???
:
:
: Or landed.
:

Yes, but I had a clearance. Granted the clearance was to be at a fix by a specific time when taking off, and the airport
had an approach with weather above minimums.

I need to see more examples...

On Apr 16, 4:32 pm, "Blueskies" wrote:
"Ron Natalie" wrote in ting.com...

: Robert M. Gary wrote:
:
:
: So you've never taken off IFR from an airport that didn't have class D
: (or E) to the surface???
:
:
: Or landed.
:

Yes, but I had a clearance.

You definitely did not have a clearance for the class G portion of
your flight.

On Apr 16, 4:32 pm, "Blueskies" wrote:

I need to see more examples...

Then look up (just off the top of my head) Eureka, NV (05U) on
skyvector. Suppose you want to get from there to, well, anywhere under
IFR. You have no choice but enroute IFR in class G. The entire country
was once like Eureka, NV.

On Apr 16, 4:32 pm, "Blueskies" wrote:
"Ron Natalie" wrote in ting.com...

: Robert M. Gary wrote:
:
:
: So you've never taken off IFR from an airport that didn't have class D
: (or E) to the surface???
:
:
: Or landed.
:

Yes, but I had a clearance. Granted the clearance was to be at a fix by a specific time when taking off, and the airport
had an approach with weather above minimums.

ATC can't issue an IFR clearance for airspace that they don't control
(class G). There would be no point.

-Robert

So even though you're flying an appropriate altitude for the course
flown, theres no guarantee that when climbing/descending you won't hit
someone else doing the same?

On Apr 16, 9:33 pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
On Apr 16, 4:32 pm, "Blueskies" wrote:

"Ron Natalie" wrote in ting.com...

: Robert M. Gary wrote:
:
:
: So you've never taken off IFR from an airport that didn't have class D
: (or E) to the surface???
:
:
: Or landed.
:

Yes, but I had a clearance. Granted the clearance was to be at a fix by a specific time when taking off, and the airport
had an approach with weather above minimums.

ATC can't issue an IFR clearance for airspace that they don't control
(class G). There would be no point.

-Robert

kevmor wrote:
So even though you're flying an appropriate altitude for the course
flown, theres no guarantee that when climbing/descending you won't hit
someone else doing the same?

Yep, big sky.

There actually has been an FAA enforcment action that says that
climb/descend in uncontrolled airspace without a clearance for
obtained for the part in controlled airspace is reckless and
dangerous. Essentially they figure that while ATC is not
excercising control in the uncontrolled area, the idea that the
"one at a time" rule in the transition area would protect you.